oDesk: One Writer’s Experience and His Plea to Clients
March 11, 2010 by Deb Ng
Filed under Freelance Bidding Sites
A guest post by Greg Minton
I was on the phone with a new client, and I couldn’t believe my luck. This software entrepreneur was clearly excited about working with me. He loved my style and indicated that our working relationship would be a long-term one. He was happy with my rate and excited about the suggestions I was making for his landing page.
But there was a problem.
He wanted to work through oDesk.
oDesk is an online bidding site similar to Elance. What sets oDesk apart is its time tracking software. This software doesn’t just track time. It also takes periodic screenshots of the freelancer’s screen, snaps webcam pictures of the freelancer, and keeps track of the freelancer’s typing rate.
I grudgingly agreed, since I had really enjoyed my interactions with this client so far.
My oDesk Experience
My client wasn’t worried about my work habits; he only wanted to work through oDesk because his marketing budget was in the oDesk escrow system. To get paid, I still had to work through the oDesk software, so I loaded up the software and started writing. He and I agreed on a set rate for the project, so we agreed that I’d just stop the clock when it reached that rate.
The first few times it took pictures and screenshots, I felt annoyed and noticed a shift in my behavior; I felt less relaxed than I usually do as I write. For example, I felt tense about shifting over to iTunes to skip a song or opening my calendar to double check an appointment.
This kind of tension while doing creative work is never a good thing.
The last straw was when I received an e-mail, switched over to check it, and started to read an e-mail from another client. At that moment, the screen flickered, indicating that oDesk was taking a screenshot. While this e-mail contained no sensitive information, the very idea that sensitive client information could potentially be compromised through oDesk was unacceptable to me.
The Fundamental Problem With oDesk
My situation with oDesk was fairly innocuous. I called my client to renegotiate a different payment method, and things worked out.
However, I learned from the oDesk experience and gleaned some potentially useful principles for both creative professionals and clients.
oDesk’s time tracking and monitoring software is increasing in popularity with clients, and this is not occurring in a vacuum. I see oDesk’s growing popularity (and its mere existence) as an effect of particular client paradigm, not the sole or primary cause.
- 1. oDesk implies a lack of trust.
Clients who insist on monitoring their freelancers’ work behavior send a very clear message to the freelance professional: “I don’t trust you.”
Why else would they want to watch their freelancers’ computer screens, treating them as though they are eight years old?
Successful business relationships are built at the relationship level, not at the contractual level. Yes, there is a necessary element of self-protection involved in any contractual relationship.
However, if a client-contractor relationship starts off from the standpoint of “I’m not so sure you’re going to do the work, so I’m going to stand over your back,” then the freelancer will have no reason to reciprocate trust.
- 2. oDesk ignores how freelancers actually work.
Freelance writers are creative professionals. We’re not producing widgets. I can understand a manager’s desire to supervise an assembly line of factory workers. Freelancers work differently, though. We need creative flow, and monitoring software just doesn’t allow this flow when it takes a picture every five minutes.
As another example of oDesk ignoring how freelancers work, I organize large projects with notecards. I lay them out on my desk and organize the flow of the piece. This is clearly billable time, as it is time solely devoted to the client’s project. In this scenario, oDesk would snap pictures of iTunes and would show no keyboard typing.
oDesk ignores that there’s more to writing than typing into a Word document – most projects involve planning, preparation, and research.
- 3. oDesk can potentially harm confidential business relationships.
Most freelancers don’t just have one client. As of the time of writing this article, I have about six active projects, and two more in the pipeline. Sometimes, I open an e-mail from one client as I work on another clients’ project. What happens if oDesk snaps a picture of confidential business information? I absolutely refuse to compromise my clients’ confidential information for the sake of an untrusting client.
- The issue isn’t fundamentally about oDesk. It’s about the way that clients view their freelancers – and how freelancers view themselves. oDesk’s rise in popularity is alarming, as it is an indication of an ever-increasing lack of trust towards freelance writers.
- My plea to clients is this: If you don’t trust your freelance writer, ask for references. If you still don’t trust him, don’t hire him. Foster a relationship of trust from the very beginning, and you won’t have to keep tabs on your freelance writer.
I’m not interested in being on a nanny-cam. Wouldn’t touch a project like that with a ten foot poll and wouldn’t consider subjecting anyone else to that kind of crap.
In addition to the intrusion, implied lack of trust, etc., I wonder about the potential legal ramifications of this stuff. At some point, people cross the line between hiring freelancers and hiring employees. This kind of monitoring system may push a few folks over that line, I’d think.
Regardless, I’d rather cram my family into an efficiency and feed them Ramen noodles and day old bread than play along with oDesk. If I wanted to have some micro-manager breathing down my neck, I’m sure I could find a number of jobby-jobs (and the protections that come with them) out there.
Some jobs just aren’t worth that kind of trouble. If you’re afraid you’re paying for time not spent on your project, either don’t hire the person or work on a flat fee. Sheesh!
Sounds very Winston-ish!
On the flip side, some clever contractors might be able to convince employers who insist on “in-office” writers to allow telecommuting using oDesk (with the assurance that a monitoring program will keep track of time and efficiency).
Before Greg and I discussed his experience, I was under the impression that the Big Brother thing was optional. For some reason I thought writers could say no to the spycam. Glad to know this now and spread the word.
@Deb – Apparently it is possible to work on a fixed rate, but neither I nor my client have figured out how to do so. The point of the matter, though, is that oDesk is marketing themselves based on the tracking software. That’s what sets them apart from Elance.
That was one thing that worried me about the Odesk method. Like most freelancers, I multitask, sometimes to recharge my creative batteries. I also do thinking and planning offline. A system that takes no account of that isn’t terribly useful. I hadn’t even really thought about the implied lack of trust, but now that you bring it up, it’s a valid point. My clients trust me to get the job done; how I do that is up to me. I do find time tracking software useful so I can keep an eye on project costs, but I don’t want to have it imposed from outside.
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I couldn’t agree more.
Not only would a ‘normal’ employer never dare to peek over your shoulder every few minutes, the whole set-up of the Odesk tracker completely overlooks the fact that we are not employees. Would you ask for screenshots of your lawyers computer? Or CCTV on your plumber? It’s insulting – I do a lot for my clients, but the reason I work for myself is to avoid the edginess of needing to ‘look busy’ so I won’t be doing this.
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And for what it’s worth, I’m totally happy to be working with this client — he’s turned out to be one of my favorite clients
The few times I’ve taken jobs through oDesk, I’ve actually had pretty positive experiences. That said, I have never taken an hourly job through oDesk, nor would I. I’ve been invited to interview for several hourly jobs and I simply contacted the client and explained that I don’t work that way, but that I’d be happy to discuss the scope of the project and produce a fixed-rate quote for them. I still run it through oDesk, so they get their 10 points or whatever for making the introduction, and the client still has funds in escrow to give them the warm fuzzies.
I’ve heard oDesk called e-slavery, and I think it’s a pretty accurate description when you’re talking about coding jobs that pay $1.50 an hour to some poor shlub in Bangladesh and the client still wants to make sure the poor shlub isn’t taking too long on his bathroom break. The only other problem I’ve seen with the site is the expectation to be able to hire a writer to pen the Magna Carta and then expect to pay him/her $20 for the project. I’ve learned that when I get an invitation to interview for a 4,000-word grant proposal and they’ve budgeted $250 for the project to just say “thanks, but no thanks” rather than trying to educate the client about getting what he pays for.
I’ve commented about this before, on another blog. It’s disgusting, and I stick my finger up to it. I left the 9-5 workplace because I like having the freedom to do as I want, when I want – and as long as I get the work done on time, to the required standard, whose business is it if I have Twitter open in another window, or take some time out to instant-message my friend on Skype?
I always log my start-stop times in my little notepad timesheet and clients are never, ever shortchanged for what I do. Sometimes I just work better in 20-minute bursts. That’s how I am, but I shouldn’t be penalised (explicitly or implicitly) for it.
And I’m damned if I’m going to answer to anyone for how I choose to organise my workflow. That’s what a boss does, and I have no boss but myself.
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This was a spectacular article! Thank you for the great advice!
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I’m a freelance writer who has used Odesk a lot. It gave me my break into freelance writing but I do have to say like many creative types I do not work well this way.
Odesk does allow for a flat fee which I prefer. The problem is, however, with the screen cap and productivity measures you do feel like you can’t answer the phone, check an urgent email or even go to the bathroom without ‘pausing’ your activities – something anyone in any workplace would not have to do. And if you’re constantly having to ‘pause’ your billing time it looks as though you’re unfocused and not committed to the job.
Unfortunately, many clients begin from a standpoint that writers are flaky, unproductive and not really offering a valuable service. They often don’t see the value until they have the end product and may feel wary about employing an offsite freelancer for the first time. Odesk gives the client more peace of mind, but I do agree that it’s very difficult and often more unproductive to work this way.
I quite like Odesk but I feel it’s ability to provide work for quality freelancers is fast dissolving. The amount of times I’ve been contacted to write 500 words for a dollar, or get emailed with a ‘lucrative writing job’ that offers a ‘great deal’ paying $3 an hour is ridiculous. The sad thing is that I see many US workers selling their skills for $5-$10 an hour, making it very hard for professional freelancers to charge a sustainable fee.
This is so true. We waste a lot of time sorting through the junk that offers $1/500words. They’re everywhere.
oDesk is a global marketplace. That’s their position and I think it’s a good one. It’s not like Demand Studios that accept only US writers (heard they accept Canadian and British writers now). However, being global is also the reason why most are forced to lower down their rates if they want to get a project.
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Have to agree with carson about legal ramifications, particularly if there is sensitive information in an e-mail. I’m no lawyer, but I would venture to say there are a ton of potential liability issues with this.
As a computer security expert as well as a freelance writer, oDesk gives me the screaming heebie-jeebies. What I do for one client is no business of another’s, and the legal implications are frightening. If it keeps track of the typing rate, there’s no reason to think the oDesk system couldn’t be compromised by a wily hacker and turned into a keylogger: something that records every keystroke typed. That could jeopardize login credentials, even banking and credit card information, especially when combined with screenshots and webcam. There are better and far less intrusive ways to track time.
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This was an EXCELLENT article! While I might be a good candidate for the oDesk hourly clocking (I get so involved that hours will pass before I look up at the clock), I don’t do command performances. If my clients want to check me out, they can either call my references or look at my LinkedIn profile.
I agree with Triona -
I tried oDesk once about two years ago and their software freaked me out! I uninstalled it from my computer immediately. Hypothetically, if I worked for these slave-drivers, these people would have my IP address, email accounts, home address, and then it would only be a matter of time before my bank account and credit card account was hacked. How is there not a class-action lawsuit against this company? In time, I am sure there will be one.
I started out on the bidding sites, but oDesk was one I stayed away from. I just wasn’t comfortable about a person taking screenshots of my PC, and timing the way I work. My thinking is, so long as I submit my deliverables on the agreed upon time, why is there a need to check on how I work? It’s like having a boss stand behind you, and taking pictures from time to time. No thanks.
Besides, the good jobs on bidding sites are few and far in between. I can get more per page of copy working in my home country, which appalls some buyers, but hey. Them’s the rates, even in the developing world!
I have used oDesk to recruit some research assistants from time to time, and also thought the webcam stuff was optional. This reminds me of a time when a client requested to “watch me” via screen sharing, so he could “learn my workflow” and develop some of his own content. I had to gently remind him the distinction between hiring a freelancer and going to a writing seminar before I eventually turned down the gig.
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I’m a regular reader of you blog, Deb; thanks for all of the great advice.
I’m what I assume is a somewhat uncommon type of “newbie” freelance writer. After a successful 10-year career as a metro daily newspaper reporter, I went back to grad school and then spent the next 15 years in corporate communications. After a very difficult and painful Great Recession-fueled corporate firing, I’m back trying to create a business based on freelance writing and contract/consulting PR and communications work.
Primarily because I relocated to a new state and region for the corporate job that didn’t work out, and hence had very few local contacts in my new hometown, I felt the need to try to re-start my freelance efforts on three of the online bidding sites. I can report that I’ve had the best luck and best results with oDesk, including a new client paying $100 an hour.
The thing I like the most about oDesk is that there’s no payment drama. The service guarantees that hourly freelancers will be paid. I get an email weekly asking that I check my online time records and 10 days later, I transfer money electronically to my bank account with no additional fees.
I understand your situation is far different than mine, but I don’t have the same problem with the oDesk tracking software. If I’m being paid by the hour for work for an oDesk client, I don’t think I should be checking email from other clients, shopping at Amazon or doing anything else online during that other than working for that client. It’s true the service counts keystrokes, but it doesn’t record what you’re typing. If I’m doing offline research or proofreading an assignment on paper, I let the clock run and add a note to the software’s memo field, in case a client questions why there’s time booked with no keystrokes. I’ve never had a payment dispute on oDesk.
I hope to reach a point where work through bid sites isn’t necessary, but it’s been very slow going. I’m doing work for two other non-bid content sites and am sending proposals for other appropriate work I hear or read about on Craig’s List, indeed.com, and yours and other sites. Although I have considerable writing experience, I’m finding it difficult to break in. If anyone has suggestions (particularly if you have a moment to review my Web site), I’m all ears.
HI Karen,
Thanks for offering another look at the oDesk experience. It looks like it’s a solution that works for you. I’m not sure it would work for me though. As a freelancer, I don’t want my clients keeping track of my hours and keystrokes, that’s why I’m freelancing. I left corporate America because I couldn’t stand micromanagement and I won’t tolerate it from my clients.
With that said, everyone’s experiences are different. It works for you and I respect that.
I refuse to work on oDesk or using any time tracking software. I do not bid on hourly rate projects. I only bid flat fee. I’m always surprised by clients who object to that (and yeah, there are some) – they think that if they micro manage a writer or subcontractor on an hourly basis, they get better work. Good luck to them. I’m never working that way again. I did one project on an hourly basis last spring and after the guy kept calling me every HOUR to ask for an update, I’d had enough. I LEFT the corporate world to leave behind micro managing idiots. I have no intention of recreating the experience in my new freelance life.
Geeze, when I’ve worked in an office I haven’t been spied on that much… I mean I could answer the phone, take bathroom breaks, stop for lunch or just because I needed to stretch…
Just say no to this…
Couldn’t stand it and blogged http://bit.ly/bTrTNO
Anne Wayman´s last blog ..How I’d Negotiate With Clients Wanting oDesk “Features”
wow! I work through odesk frequently and never really thought about how subtly uncomfortable I am with the tracking clock popping up (and it doesn’t take into account ‘thinking’ time). So far though, I have had zero clients question the ‘activity’ level I posted or my ‘offline’ time added. I do agree though, I prefer fixed price assignments.
Greg,
Thanks for sharing your experience. I always find it useful to hear directly from users, though there are a couple of common misconceptions you bring up that I’d like to address.
- Misconception: oDesk users are forced to work through oDesk Team.
Reality: oDesk encourages users to try the oDesk Team app and be familiar with it, and many users find compelling reasons to use the system. Over 70% of work performed on oDesk is hourly, and our users tell us that they prefer this model because it lends itself to longer-term relationships with their buyers, and to more meaningful and lucrative work.
However, some contractors find that they don’t need the benefits of guaranteed payment and choose to work on an “all offline time” or fixed-price basis. oDesk guarantees payment on hourly work logged through the oDesk Team app, but also handles invoicing for these alternatives if that is how the user prefers to work.
-Misconception: oDesk Team shares private information you may not want shared.
Reality: Users have complete control over information shared in their Work Diary. They can turn the oDesk Team app on and off with a single click, make notes to accompany their uploaded screenshots, and discard screenshots either before or after they are uploaded to the shared Work Diary. Webcam shots are optional, and default to “off” unless selected otherwise. Accidentally share an email with info from another client? No problem, just delete that screenshot from your work diary.
Lastly, you argue that using oDesk Team implies a lack of trust. The vast majority of our users state the opposite: using oDesk Team enhances trust and leads to longer-term work relationships. Online work gives users access to opportunities far beyond local area and personal networks, and many find they are hired by people they don’t personally know or have limited references for – and vice versa. oDesk Team is designed to be a tool to help encourage communication and build trust where it otherwise may not exist.
We recognize that not everyone will find the Work Diary and payment guarantee aligned with the way they work. We’ve tried to account for other ways people work, and encourage contractors to have conversations with their clients to decide if oDesk Team, offline work or some combination thereof is the right fit for them.
Best regards,
Erica Benton
Marketing Communications Manager
oDesk.com
I’ve been badly burnt by clients who didn’t pay me in the past. For me, oDesk’s guaranteed payment is a small price to pay for the peace of mind of knowing that you’re not working in vain.
It’s true that the screenshots are a hassle, my writing habit has changed because of this. I’m forced to waste time there because some buyers think that “fast writer = poor quality”. Basically, I’m not earning as much as I think I should.
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Frankly, the idea of odesk (or anyone else) watching me gives me the creeps.
Writing and creativity are a funny thing. Sometimes it just flows out of your head, like you’re taking dictation. Other times, it’s a long,hard slog. There are times when writing looks a lot like staring into space. Other times, I’m bent over the keyboard, typing furiously.
I’d much rather work on a flat fee basis (fairer to me, and to the client) than have a virtual Big Brother standing over me.
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I fail to see what the big deal is.
You probably have more than one computer, don’t you? The only thing this is good for is making ignorant clients feel like they have you under their thumb. It’s not actually going to stop anyone so motivated from doing whatever they want.
But yes, on principal, I’d go nowhere near it.
I’ve been with oDesk for a year, and one of the first things I figured out is how to opt out of the web cam. No one has to see you while you work. You just have to pay attention when you are loading the software. All anyone sees of me is a nice little photo–not my jammies and bedhead. That option is mainly for teams, which is brilliant for that purpose.
The second thing I figured out is how to deleted any screenshot I don’t want seen. If I forget that I’m working and open an email from another client, I go delete that image. Actually, working this way has helped me develop better work habits. When you agree to be paid hourly, you at least owe your client the courtesy of not working on someone else’s job while you are working on their dime. So that has helped me stay focused. One job at a time.
The third thing I figured out is that payment comes faster with oDesk. One of my dearest friends hired me to work on a project and didn’t send me a check for 3 months. A huge publishing corporation hired me and didn’t get me a check for 2. Recently someone else hired me and didn’t pay me for 2 months as well. I’ve had some bad experiences waiting for checks. With oDesk, I know I’ll get paid promptly, right to my bank. It’s a dream to have a regular payday but still be my own boss.
I had the opportunity to work long term with a client recently and told them I wanted them to hire me through oDesk–THAT’S how happy I am with the service. They were thrilled.
And I do consider it a service that is for my benefit. As far as switching to iTunes or working off line, I do that if I need to, and my clients understand. You can type what you are doing into your memo or add offline time as necessary. If a client knows that’s how you work, they shouldn’t have a problem with it–especially for writers. I know sometimes I have stared at the screen for up to ten minutes without touching a key … that’s just how it goes when I’m thinking and I’ve never had a single complaint about it.
As for them spying more than a normal office … maybe. But you forget that people get ripped off all the time. Once burned twice shy. I don’t want someone not to hire me because another freelancer ripped them off. Also, a lot of normal offices read your emails and have safety systems so they can keep log of what you are typing. I worked for a corporation that did that. Does it suck? Yes. If you are doing something you shouldn’t be doing on the job.
The system protects me. I have proof that I spent the time and did the work. I have nothing to hide, can delete any accidental personal stuff that is captured, and I know I’ll get paid. It works for me.
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Good point Deb. There is not doubt that consistent screen capturing by odesk software puts annoying effects on mind of provider specially if he/she is busy in writing or other sort of creative work.
However If you have won buyer’s trust then oDesk offers you facility to add ‘offline hours’ in your work diary. These hours will work same as ‘logged hours’. But they need buyer’s confirmation before getting into payment schedule which should be no problem in case of a great mutual understanding.